Naruto Sharingan

I think Anbu and Ninja rank are totally separate ... Anbu accepts into its ranks anyone, no matter ninja level, that it finds will be an asset. Kakashi was already a Jounin when he became an Anbu member (I wonder why he's not anymore) but I have a feeling once you become an Anbu member, you don't exactly enter chunin exams, etc. So someone like Sai, who grew up within Anbu, mightn't have a ninja rank at all.

That said, Sai is probably at lower Jounin level (he is described as the greatest of his generation and it seems he did capture Yamato fairly easily) but cuz he's in Anbu, this kinda is arbitrary.
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If this was a bell test by Kakashi, which it wasn't, the results of the fight would be the similar but who knows if they would have failed or not? It's parallel to what happened in the first bell test, but if Sai got a bell, things might have gone differently ...Remember during the 1st bell test, Kakashi taunted Naruto so he started before Kakashi said to begin. Yamato just waited to motivate Naruto until the training had started. Naruto, who started by using teamwork this time (Yamato did say one would go in while the other backed up the first), still DID go in for the kill before Sai or Sakura had a chance to participate. This behavior ultimately resulted in Naruto again being bound and removed from the remaining fight, although by a different culprit.Sai forcibly removed Naruto from the fight because he decided Naruto would just be a burden. This was Sasuke's attitude if you remember way back, although Sasuke wouldn't have binded Naruto but let Naruto continue to get himself in more trouble because THEN Naruto is an even greater distraction... Like Sai did, Sasuke just let Naruto be a distraction 'til he could hopefully take Kakashi by surprise. Sai at least openly admitted that he planned to use Naruto in this way ... Sasuke was in denial at that point that Naruto was helpful in any way.

Now I think Sai wouldn't have gotten a bell from Kakashi. This would mean once again they would still have ended up with Naruto tied to the post and the other two eating and getting the teamwork speech from Kakashi. But this speech would likely first go over Sai's head ... and it would this time be Sakura who initiated the feeding of Naruto for the pass. Sai wouldn't feed Naruto just cuz Sakura does, and might even want to fight with Naruto still tied up, but Sakura could probably force Sai into it ...But lets say Sai completed the mission and as this was a bell test, then he'd have gotten a bell ... but he'd only get one for himself and we know thats an instant fail for Kakashi. Would Kakashi still have given them a second shot and the team speech if Sai got a bell? And if it still ended up with Naruto tied to the post and the other two eating, getting the teamwork speech from Kakashi et al, why would Sai feed Naruto if he sees his mission as completed? The fact that Sai can justify his complacency toward the other two with his success just helps fuel the non-teamwork attitude and his faulty belief in the mission over companionship. A success would give Sai the sway needed to veto any decision by the other two toward teamwork from that point forward ... This would seriously undermine a pass by Kakashi, much like how it is undermining smooth cooperation currently among Team Kakashi.

Originally Posted by Devilguy:

The one who screwed up was Naruto. Sai was pissed off and taught him a lesson

Yeah, Naruto did screw up and in typical fashion, lost track of the stratergy when taunted ... I am curious to know if the henge clone was a team plan or if Naruto was just leaving Sai out of it in the first place. Either way, Naruto was the one who was going for the kill BY HIMSELF after that taunt.

Yet, that is still no excuse for Sai attacking a companion. What treatment did he expect after the way he's pissed off Naruto so far? That Naruto would suddenly be warm towards him? Attacking Naruto, then telling Naruto the best way to accomplish the mission was to tie up and leave Naruto out of it AND THEN bringing up the sensitive Sasuke issue again - what was Sai hoping would happen? That Naruto would accept his way of thinking just like that? Sai needs to gain some perspective along with the teamwork gene. I wonder how Kakashi would/will handle him? Normally, his behavior would totally undermine teamwork at all but thank goodness Naruto is so determined that in his uniquely honest fashion he will continue to work with someone he hates. "I will do anything to save that friend ... even work with you." - It's so classic Naruto to say something unexpected and twisted like that. Loved it! Good to see Naruto taking the higher ground ... and it also makes total sense that Sai remained clueless to the emotions motivating this determination. Well done Kishimoto!

Originally Posted by Devilguy:

It was much better to teach Naruto such a lesson during the training session than letting him behave as he always does and expect that he miraculously doesn't repeat the same error again during the real mission.

But since when has it been Sai's place to teach Naruto anything? If Yamato scolded him it would be one thing but Sai isn't in a position to be so condesending, even if he did accomplish the mission. You think Naruto didn't notice he screwed up? It might even be ok if Sai just lectured Naruto for the mistake after the mission; it's not ok to force a person out of the mission (by tying them up) for a mistake and then still lecture them about it. That's overkill and arrogance.

Why did Naruto deserve to be tied up? Cuz he attacked on his own? Cuz he gave the clone thing away with the Rasengan? or cuz of his exclusion of Sai as a teammate the previous chapter?

Saying that Sai can suddenly scold Naruto cuz he accomplished the mission is like saying a student who gets an A on a test has the right to mock a student who recieves a C. Not cool. And I agree scolding Naruto doesn't work but isn't that exactly what Sai tries to do after the mission when explaining his actions? To be completely honest, if I was in Sai's shoes I'd be annoyed with Naruto and worried about teaming up with him too, yet still I see myself confronting the issue more overtly than an attack mid training ... . If Sai feels Naruto is weak, he should offer help (even if he and we know Naruto wouldn't accept it) not criticism.

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Binding Naruto was a far lesser crime than leaving Sakura to die and cause Naruto no harm .... but he still DID use a jutsu on a teammate ... which is a controversal move even in the best circumstances. Plot wise it was fantastic but I had just as big a problem with Sasuke and Naruto using jutsu's against eachother during the rooftop fight .... and you saw where that led .... You are supposed to work with teammates, not around them.

If Naruto purposely downed the bridge to keep his teammates safe from himself, I would say Naruto is MORE blame worthy when it comes to Sakura than if he did it completely by accident in a moment of Kyuubitized rage. It was a mistake; yet with this new motive, it was also poor planning, not just a fluke of the chaos. Sai did a much worse thing because of his CLEAR DECISION to ignore Sakura:

Naruto's motivation choices:

A) Destroy bridge to protect teammates from 4-tail form

B) KILL KABUTO, oops - whatever, KILL OROCHIMARU, KILL OROCHIMARU

Sai's motivation choices:

A) Ignore Sakura to complete MISSION cuz My duty over worthless Teammate

B) Sakura dying is just deserts for punching me, why should I care?

On face value it looks like Sai is in the better position because unlike Naruto who actually harmed Sakura (accident or not) and did it in the act of trying to kill someone, Sai just let he fall for the sake of his duty. But Naruto either has the insanity plea or was trying to protect her ... he never made the CHOICE to harm her. Sai CHOOSE to ignore her and therefore, is much more accountable for his actions.

Originally Posted by Oknytt

Not that I think Sai really cares, but he's remains loyal to Danzou while betraying Konoha. He's now in the same group of traitors as Konohas White Fang, betraying the villages higher rules. Choosing comrades over a 'higher cause', you could say he is following Narutos way of the ninja.

The white fang chose to save his companions over the mission ... Sai is ignoring one mission to instate another, and putting his companions at risk by doing so.

Firstly, I think you have to look at the motivations behind these actions. Yes, like Sakumo, Sai is refusing to follow through with a mission due to extrenuating circumatances dealing with where his true loyalty lies ... but Sakumo's disobedience was to save his companion's lives while Sai's is to (or so it seems) collaborate with a known enemy for the sake of a former mentor. I do not think these reasons are at all equally rightous. Sakumo was fighting directly against what was expected of him as a Shinobi for the sake of being a better person while Sai is being a worse person by allowing himself to become a tool and doing exactly what is expected of a Shinobi.

Secondly, you are ignoring that with the White Fang no third party was involved. The White Fang also betrayed the Konoha elite but he did not betray or endanger the lives of any teammates he was with at the time. And it doesn't really matter how powerful Danzou is ... what Sai does is still underhanded. We might make the same decision as he would but he still treats his teammates like crap. Let me see if I can put this in a modern setting.

Imagine you are living on the streets, by yourself, when one day you happen to meet a guy in a business suit. Turns out he's a CEO, and he saw something he liked and trained you to be a genius businessman. You as his right hand man for years. He is like a father to you.

But then his company is bought out from under him. You stay with the company because you have no other options and he tells you to. Now you are working for a new CEO, who's doing a good job (maybe even a better job than the former CEO) but you have no personal relationship with her. You are loyal to the company but you owe her nothing.

The old CEO still has a lot of sway with the executive board and is able to convince them to add you to a team for a specific project, and you're new fellow employees are all personal appointments of the new CEO. Then you find out you were added to this project so the Old CEO can make a deal with a competative company (possibly a merge because in the OLD CEO's opinion, the company is floundering ... although you can't be sure this is true) behind the new CEO's back.

What do you do? The old CEO is like your father, you owe him everything. But he isn't your boss anymore and your new teammates are depending on you. Now comes the moment of truth. Do you do whatever task your father figure has asked of you if it means one of your fellow workers will then loose her job in the process?

It's understandable that your loyalties lie with the old CEO who made you who you are, and if you do do him the favor. BUT it DOES NOT make you unblameable if you don't ALSO try to help out the innocent party who will otherwise loose everything just by the unfortunate luck of also being on your team.

Sakumo chose to not finish the project (although it most probably hurt the company a lot) so that way none of his teammates would loose their jobs in the process of it's completion. Sai chose to work on the bigger merger (which might help the company in the long run ... or might ruin the company for whatever reason the OLD CEO wishes) instead of the project, not caring what happened to his fellow coworkers at all.

People are to blame when they let the status quo and expectations stand as is if they are faulty notitions. Just because a Shinobi is expected to be a tool doesn't give people the right to treat others that way or to allow themselves to be manipulated as such. It is understandable that it happens to those that are lonely (as we know Loneliness is the root of all evil in Naruto) but it doesn't mean that it ok that it happens and shouldn't be fought against.

And why is Sakura is not to blame?

... she was just in the wrong place and didn't have time to react.

A)Sakura was in shock cuz this is the first time she's seen her narizzle go to the shizzle (remember she's only seen the 0-tail state twice during the chunin exam ... otherwise she's been knocked out or fighting elsewhere)

B) It happened really fast. It wasn't like she was just gawking at a long fight before her. Kabuto charged one second and was flung to kingdom come the next. Even if she was prepared she didn't have enough time to duck.

C) Ninjas far older and wiser (Kabuto, Yamato, and even Orochimaru) were surprised when it happened ... and you really expected Sakura to be prepared?

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Originally Posted by Odlam:

What if Sai's mission has nothing to do with Naruto or attacking Orochimaru, but is actually him delivering a message to Orochimaru from Danzou about "future negotiations" between the two or something like that

I do like this theory - a lot. Works well with the fact that Sai was added to Kakashi's team (the most likely team to met Orochimaru) until the opportunity for his mission arose (instead of just being added for this particular mission when they didn't know they would met Orochimaru and it might be easier to get to Kyuubi without Kakashi around.) not for a specific amount of time.

BUT I PREFER ....

Could Sai's mission from Danzou be a suicide mission? Could his purpose from the start be to give up his life in front of a bezerk KN so that Tsunade (in the face of this scandal) is forced to choose between Naruto's freedom and the village's safety? This would explain why he was taught to have no emotions, not connect with his comrades, why he would care what happened to the rest of the team including not go to save Sakura, why his mission wouldn't start until Naruto Kyuubitized and why Sai would immediately head that way with no regard for the obvious dangers.

I don't think Sai will actually die (he still needs to become Naruto's bitch ) ... either Naruto will gain his senses in time or Yamato will intervene ... but I still think this could be Sai's purpose and that he will just fail to complete this mission.

Originally Posted by Windy:

Sounds awesome, but I don't think so. Danzou seems to have a lot of appreciation to Sai's skills, and if that was the mission, he would've sent someone he wouldn't care to lose...

I see your point but I find this would be the exact reason he would send him. Danzou is a war monger and probably sees missions like these as the greatest honors available. I think the way Danzou treats Sai is much like the way the heads of modern terrorist organizations behave towards promising children they turn into suicide bombers.

298 Update: Damn. I was pushing for the suicide mission but I didn't want it to happen this way! As much as I feel it is unlikely that Sai is dead I would absolutely love it if for once Kishimoto broke the mold and had us instead have Naruto influenced by Sai postmotum by causing Naruto guilt and regret AND furthering the reality that not everyone can nor deserves to be saved by him. The best plot twist I can imagine is a plan by Orochimaru/Kabuto to kill Sai to use as the corpse for the dead soul technique of Kabuto's - hoping to trap Yamato who they don't know is a clone. The intention is to obtain Yamato and then revive Sai via Edo Tensei or something similar. But once they realize Yamato is really Yamato's Bunshin the plan will backfire and Orochimaru and Kabuto will unhappily flee ... leaving poor, used, abused Sai behind to be found by the rest of Team Kakashi.

Sai " I can't get close " (because of shockwaves Naruto is emitting) ... He could wish to get close for any number of reasons ... to get to Naruto (to kill, help, investigate), to get to Orochimaru (to kill, help, investigate), even to get in the way via the suicide mission theory. He could be talking in the sense of stratergy (I can't get close cuz I'll get hurt) or in the sense of physically (I want to get close but everytime I approach I get blasted back) ....

Chapter 296 Update:

By now we have had enough hints not to trust that specific smile of Sai's.... from that one frame we can't know what Sai is really up to and I have always advocated the Sai suicide mission theory although I thought he was gonna throw himself in front of Naruto instead of attack Orochimaru.

Danzou warhawk stuff was used to throw us off the scent of his real plans ... having more to do with the Jinchuuriki and less to do with distabilizing the Konoha government. Danzou might be willing (although I still prefer the idea that Sai is faking it right now) to form an alliance with Orochimaru to take down Akatsuki - not because of their attacks on Naruto but because of whatever ultimate plans the organization has.

Danzou probably realized that Kakashi's team was the most likely Konoha team to meet up with Orochimaru because he knew they would eventually be sent after Sasuke if any info was found. That's at least my guess why Danzou put him on the team indefinitely until the secret mission was accomplished, not just this specific bridge mission.

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Sai's book I believe can be interpreted many ways but the two that seemed most logical to me (I do believe Sai is the one transforming not the opponent) were either:

A) Abstract intepretation - Sai does not actually take the clothing and weapons of his opponents but the drawings symbolize the emotional journey he's been on and the weight and experience he's gained by facing each opponent.

or B) Sai (and his brother?) actually does physically transform with each opponent he faces. If this is true we have an interesting parallel to Orochimaru's immortality body transfer technique. It is true that Sai only takes the clothing and weaponry of each new user .... but what if this is some upgraded version of the technique? And what if it also as an upgrade includes the ability to transfer much more frequently than every three years ... ie, whenever one battles. This also could partically explain Orochimaru's interest in keeping Sai if Danzou's note left any indication Sai had this ability.